Herbert's Idea Box

I've been reading non-Dune Frank Herbert sci-fi and I've noticed he definitely seems to have a number of ideas that he repeatedly uses. This is not a bad thing at all, just the areas he seems to be interested in. At this point I've only read Hellstrom's Hive and Eyes of Heisenberg but definite patterns emerge. Spoilers for the above and the Dune Chronicles.

Ecology- Dune Chronicles, Hellstrom's Hive

Genetics- Dune Chronicles, Hellstrom's Hive, Eyes of Heisenberg

Sterile low-caste members: Workers in Hellstrom's Hive, Tleilaxu Face Dancers in Dune Chronicles, Sterries in Eyes of Heisenberg

Women converted into artificial wombs: Axlotl tanks in Dune Chronicles, Stumps in Hellstrom's Hive

Secret hand language- Couriers in Eyes of Heisenberg, The Hive in Hellstrom's Hive, Bene Gesserit in Dune Chronicles

Immortal being(s) ruling society as the head of a religion- Optimen in Eyes of Heisenberg, Leto II in God Emperor of Dune

Super-weapons- Unnamed planet sterilizer used by the Honored Matres in Heretics of Dune, Project 40 in Hellstrom's Hive

Head of Military/Security who is eventually killed by his Superior(s) but always duplicated and returned to life- Max Allgood in Eyes of Heisenberg, Duncan Idaho in God Emperor of Dune

Philosophy Question #3

Role of religion in society?

In Dune, religion plays an extremely large role in the ongoing story of the fictional world. Frank Herbert's world building is such that a fully realized world is laid out before the reader, and like the real world, religion is very important. But what role does Herbert assign religion in society? There are many schools of thought as to why religion exists. According to Freud, religion existed as wish fulfillment. Religious people simply imagined a world that was structured according to what they wished the real world was like. Good people are always rewarded in the end, evil always punished, things happen for a reason etc.

In Dune, we see this idea with a bit of a twist. The Messianic Fremen religion, like all messianic faiths, has a strong element of wish fulfillment. The Fremen have been oppressed and abused for thousands of years, and they believe that once their Messiah comes they will rise up against their tormentors. This happens in Dune when Paul becomes the Kwisatz Haderach, the Mahdi, etc and the Fremen begin their Jihad against the Imperium. Arrakis becomes the Imperial home world and billions of people are put to the sword as the Fremen exhaust their blood lust against the galaxy at large.

The interesting part of this is that Paul sees that he is largely useless in this process. The Fremen need only think their Messiah has come to set the Jihad in motion, Paul actually being alive or directing them isn't necessary. If Paul dies it would continue under his mother, if his mother died it would continue under Chani, or Stilgar. If all these people died it would continue in his memory alone. Paul knows that once Sietch Tabr believes him to be the messiah in the Cave of the Birds, the rest is a foregone conclusion assuming only a single Fremen lives to carry the word to his or her brethren.

This tells us that it isn't the physical Messiah that is needed, only the catalyst. After all, the Fremen being so powerful there was no reason the Jihad could not have begun ten, or even a hundred years earlier. All they needed was permission to go about what they wanted. In this sense, their religion really was all about wish fulfillment, they didn't NEED a messiah, they needed only to believe their messiah had come to seize power.

Film Adaptation

There is a new Dune movie in the rumblings. Will the project fall apart? Kinda looks like it, but who knows? This will be the third time Dune has been made into an adaptation, and each time there were some problems.

I think an issue at heart is whether to make a good movie or a good adaptation? For example, someone could probably make a knockout Dune movie but cut out a number of characters:

Duncan Idaho

Thufir Huwit

Beast Rabban

Gurney Halleck

These are all important characters (well maybe not Rabban), but the point is there could be a good movie that cuts alot out. As a fan I feel a sort of natural rejection of this, but it is assuredly true. Both Stanley Kubrick films The Shining and A Clockwork Orange left the authors of the books they were based off of greatly dissatisfied, but both were great movies.

On the other hand, Peter Jackson's Lord of the Rings series, that series third try as well, managed to be both a good movie AND a good adaptation. As the newest movie started off as a studio project, not a project of a specific auteur, I doubt we'll get either.

Dune as Anarchist text?

Trying to get a concrete political read from Dune is pretty difficult. The world presented is one of feudalism, but many of the protagonists lament the rigid class system. The hero of the first book becomes Emperor, which then leads to the deaths of billions of people. This violence is attributed to the oppression and social decay of the feudal system. So, what then should be in it's place?

That can be hard to figure too. Leto II takes control of the Empire as the God Emperor and cements all power within himself. He states that the actions he will take will make Paul's Jihad (which killed billions) look like a pleasant summer picnic. Is this good or bad? The gut response is that it's bad, very very bad. And yet, Leto II assures us that without his actions humanity would be completely extinct. Assuming Leto II as a hero, the work tells us that survival is more important than freedom. That to be alive and subservient is better than dead. A bold statement, perhaps?

Ultimatley, Leto II consolidates all power into himself so that when he dies the centralized power structure completely collapses, a sort of intentional Dark Ages. (aka the Scattering) Presumably this is meant to be followed by a Renaissance, a world where there is no Emperor or central authority. And indeed the universe of Heretics of Dune and Chapterhouse: Dune is one of no Emperors or Overlords, only various groups vying amongst each other.

Thus Leto II took all power for himself to destroy such power forever? The end seems to be an anarchist goal, but the method is something no anarchist could justify. Like I said, a bit inscrutable. Interesting nonetheless.

Philosophy Question #2

Defining self-hood

In the world of Dune, a Lockean view of self seems to be confirmed. Locke supposed self to be the continuity of consciousness, not related to a soul or a body.

From wikipedia:

John Locke considered personal identity (or the self) to be founded on consciousness (viz. Memory), and not on the substance of either the soul or the body. Chapter XXVII "On Identity and Diversity" in An Essay Concerning Human Understanding (1689) has been said to be one of the first modern conceptualization of consciousness as the repeated self-identification ofoneself. Through this identification, moral responsibility could be attributed to the subject and punishment and guilt could be justified, as critics such as Nietzsche would point out.

According to Locke, personal identity (the self) "depends on consciousness, not on substance" nor on the soul. We are the same person to the extent that we are conscious of our past and future thoughts and actions in the same way as we are conscious of our present thoughts and actions. If consciousness is this "thought" which "that goes along with the substance ... which makes the same person", then personal identity is only founded on the repeated act of consciousness: "This may show us wherein personal identity consists: not in the identity of substance, but... in the identity of consciousness". For example, one may claim to be a reincarnation of Plato, therefore having the same soul substance. However, one would be the same person as Plato only if one had the same consciousness of Plato's thoughts and actions that he himself did. Therefore, self-identity is not based on the soul. One soul may have various personalities.

We see this in Dune in the gholas. In Dune Messiah when Hayt regains the memories of Duncan Idaho, there is no thought of him being a pseudo Duncan or a quasi-Duncan. He is treated and considered by all to be the same person as the original Duncan Idaho. This is preserved through out the series, for example, when the Tlielaxu masters continue their lives through a continuous series of gholas. The gholas of each new master is considered to be the same as the master, despite being a different body.

Philosophy Question #1

By looking through the Canon Dune series, we find that Frank Herbert establishes definitive answers to some of philosophy's most long standing questions for the purpose of his fictional universe.

Mind Body Dualism

Canon Dune seems to reject any implication of a mind/body dualism. I state this because when it comes time for gholas to be made, any scrap of genetic material, whether a hair sample or a drop of blood, is enough to resurrect every thought and memory a person ever had. It stands then that all of the information of the mind is apparently contained in every cell of a person's body, explicitly rejecting any form of mind body dualism.

meh

It's gotten too depressing to list all the problems with the Expanded Dune series, so I'm going to stop that for now...

Criticism #11: Let's never speak of this again!

There's an episode of the Simpsons where we find that Principal Skinner is not in fact Seymour Skinner. He is a slacker who took over Skinner's identity after meeting him in Vietnam and thinking he died. At the end of the episode everyone decides that they like fake Skinner better and vow to "forget this ever happened." The Expanded Dune novels gave me the suspicion that this vow is part of a daily affirmation of House Atreides.

Numerous important life altering and person defining things happen in the Expanded Dune that are, of course, never mentioned in Canon Dune. Reading the books back to back, like I assume they are meant to be read, leads to a shocking discontinuity.

For example: Who knew that...

Leto had a previous son that died at a young age?

Was engaged to a woman that was assassinated when Paul was twelve?

And had a concubine before Jessica that killed herself?

These things wouldn't seem so bizarrely out of place, after all how often would they come up in conversation, except that the authors try to mention them as much as possible in the books that take place between the Canon Dune novels. So reading them through results in something like this:

House Atreides: Stuff

House Harkonnen: Stuff

House Corrino: Stuff

Dune: Stuff goes unmentioned

Paul of Dune: Talk about the stuff again!

Dune Messiah: Shh!! Forget about the stuff!

Winds of Dune: ...aaand now we can talk about it again.

Seriously, what the hell people?

Criticism #10: Those wacky Bene Gesserit!

The Bene Gesserit have breeding programs lasting thousands of years. They carefully cultivate talents and abilities and continue them down through generations. The Reverend Mothers have memories going back to the dawn of time, and can thus teach and learn any technique their ancestors either knew or even knew about. You know, except when they don't.

In Legends of Dune, the Sorceresses of Rossak have the ability to detonate their minds and fry the brains of nearby people. A useful ability for someone in an extreme situation. We later learn that the Sorceresses are the basis of the Bene Gesserit. And yet the Bene Gesserit never display this ability. It would have come in handy when they were being hunted by the Honored Matres!

In House Harkonnen, when the Baron and his entourage are on the surface of Wallach IX, all the Bene Gesserit there, from the lowliest acolyte to the highest Reverend Mothers, are able to seem invisible due to a mass hypnosis of the Baron and his soldiers. Invisibility! Another useful skill. I wonder why Jessica didn't teach it to the Fedaykin, since apparently children can engage in it? Or why, again, the Bene Gesserit didn't use to kick the crap out of the Honored Matres?

In Winds of Dune, we learn there are a group of Bene Gesserit called guilt casters, that can hypnotize people into a emotionally destroyed catatonic states. Again, this ability doesn't exist before this novel is written, and disappears from the Bene Gesserit arsenal the second the book ends.

Penny Arcade

Honesty Time

Criticism #9: Six=Three

A quote from Dune:

"We've known each other six years," she said. "It's long past time formalities should've been

dropped between us -- in private."

This is from a conversation between Dr. Yueh and Jessica. Paul is fifteen at the beginning of Dune. This means Yueh and Jessica met when Paul was nine.

In the novel House Harkonnen, after Rhombur Vernius is severely injured in a sabotage by Harkonnen agents Dr. Yueh comes to perform cybernetic work on him. Jessica is present at Castle Caladan during this. Did they meet? We're not sure. This was before Paul was born, so 15 or so years ago from the time of Dune.

Later, in Winds of Dune, after Rhombur Vernius dies in another assassination attempt, Dr. Yueh enters the service of House Atreides permanently. This was when Paul was twelve, three years before the novel Dune.

Which means that somehow Dr. Yueh and Jessica have known each other for some time before Yueh joins House Atreides? How? Jessica lives with the Duke on Caladan. Another lazy continuity error? Seems so.

Criticism #8: I think Gurney took too many inkvine whips to the head

The following is a quote from Dune:

"I swore an oath to slay the betrayer of your father," Gurney said. "Do you think I can forget the

man who rescued me from a Harkonnen slave pit, gave me freedom, life, and honor ... gave me

friendship, a thing I prized above all else? I have his betrayer under my knife. No one can stop me from --"

Silly Gurney. Little does he know that Duke Leto did not rescue him from a Harkonnen slave pit. Gurney rescued himself and then joined up with a gang of smugglers, as portrayed in the book House Harkonnen.

Why would Gurney lie to Paul and Jessica about this? Both have truth sense and would instantly know that Gurney just lied about something that makes no sense to lie bout. Neither comment, of course.

The alternative is that Gurney can't remember his own personal history. Or something.

I'm sure Brian Herbert and Kevin J Anderson are both perfectly nice people that meant well to write more Dune fiction. But could we at least try to avoid, at the very very least, obvious continuity errors? Is that really too much to ask?

Criticism #7: At least it's something they have in common

The following is from the original Dune:

Not since the day when the Duke's buyers had taken her from the school had she felt this frightened and unsure of herself.

This is a thought Jessica is thinking as she is unpacking their possessions in the Atreides residency.

This is in direct contradiction to the events presented in the House Harkonnen prequel novel, whereby Jessica is basically dropped off by the Bene Gesserit at the Duke's place with no fore knowledge by him and a great deal of suspicion.

Alzheimer's: it brings the Atreides together.

Criticism #6 Shoulda stayed as an Appendix

The novel House Atreides depicts Pardot Kynes, Imperial Planetologist, and his journey from off worlder to Umma, Fremen Holy Man. The novel tells us that Pardot traveled to Arrakis and with a sort of Asperger's like dedication made his way into the good graces of the locals.

He rescued a handful of Fremen children from a group of Harkonnen soldiers that were going to kill them for sport. After being taken to their Sietch, the elders decide that, water debt be damned, they have to kill him. Oblivious that a man who has approached him in a lecture is his assassin, he absent mindfully tells the man to "Remove yourself." The assassin falls on his own knife and Pardot Kynes becomes a holy man.

He marries a Fremen wife, and sets the Fremen as his personal assistants. They go where he says to and takes whatever measurements he asks them to. Tragically he dies in a cave in at Plaster Basin. This story is stretched out over hundreds of pages. It's also summarized in about 5-10 pages in an appendix in the back of Dune.

BH&KJA spent an entire novel telling the EXACT SAME story that Frank Herbert summarized briefly in an entry in the Dune appendix. Absolutely nothing of significance is added to the telling. Anyone creating fiction, whatever medium, can tell you that if you can convey the same thing with less effort, then you need to do some editing. I don't think the Expanded Dune novels were ever edited.

Criticism #5: Murder most casual

Through the House trilogy, Count Fenring, who is basically a serial killer, goes around casually murdering people and no one ever seems to notice. For example, at one point he stabs one of the Emperor's concubines to death for pretty much no reason and no one ever mentions it again.

The most absurd example of this is when Piter de Vries, the Harknonnen mentat, kills the Emperor's wife and yet House Harkonnen is not punished, censored or molested in any way. In fact, nobody really seems to care. The Emperor's freaking wife gets murdered and it's not really a big deal. What the hell?

Criticism #4: Bellonda goes bye bye!

I for one was looking forward to Bellonda's role in Hunters of Dune as Murbella's foil. Alas, BH&KJA dropped a bridge on her.

In Hunters, Bellonda gets exiled to monitor spice operations, where she doesn't participate in the plot at all. Her partner, Doria, an Honored Matre kills her in a petty fight. Murbella forces them to share and then both Doria and Bellonda-within get eaten by a sandworm. Nobody ever seems to notice or comment on this.

Criticism #3: I hope it's not inheritable...

In Dune Duke Leto says the following to Paul:

"The Duke looked at him. "This will be your first time off planet," he said."

Little did he know that Paul has actually been off world a number of times, and was even born off world. This is seen in House Corrino, Paul of Dune and Winds of Dune. Leto seems to be having early Alzheimer's. Everyone is apparently humoring him so as not to hurt his feelings. Either that, or the Expanded Dune novels have no compunction with brazenly contradicting the Original Dune novels.

Ya know, could be either option.

Criticism #2: Leto II meets God

Unpublished Epilogue to God Emperor of Dune

Leto II: So this is what it's like to be dead.

God: Hey.

Leto II: Oh wow, it's Real God. I'm glad I got that Golden Path thing sorted before I died. I have freed humanity from ever again being held under on flag, or exterminated by one foe. I have created a Dark Age so that there will be a Renaissance like never before.

God: Yeah...about that.

Leto II: What? It didn't work? I have prescience like a mother fucker, it had to work.

God: I know you really tried, kid. But in 1500 years Omnius is going to try and exterminate mankind. It'll work too, if he isn't stopped.

Leto II: Omnius? Who the fuck is Omnius?

God: Overmind of the machine empire, they've been building ships since the end of Butlerian Jiahd. He's got back ups of himself in all these nodes. Going to totally exterminate everyone.

Leto II: Nuh-uh. Don't buy it. I would have seen it. Loaded up some Heighliners with nukes and then used my prescience to simultaneously nuke all his cute little nodes from orbit. I woulda kicked his ass.

God: Yeah. But you didn't. Cuz you're all mysterious and stuff.

Leto II: So what do the humans do? Build a big fleet? Loose sandworms in his city? Fight a big war?

God: Look, I hate to be a buzz kill, but here's the deal: They do all those things. But it don't really matter. They could just as easily rolled over and hid. Remember Norma Cenva?

Leto II: She invented fold space engines.

God: She's an omnipotent super being. She can banish Omnius to a parallel dimension with her brain waves.

Leto II: So what the fuck is she waiting for? Do it right now!!

God: She doesn't know where he's at though. For that she has to follow Duncan Idaho there. Really, all that it takes is for Duncan to get captured, taken to Synchrony, then she can zap the bad guy. No reason it has to take longer than five minutes.

Leto II: Granted, I'm half man-half sandworm, but this all seems a little far fetched.

God: Sorry dude.

Leto II: ....

...

this sucks. :(

Criticism #1: the Waff ghola

Being the book I just finished, Sandworms of Dune criticisms are closest to my head. In this novel, the character of the Waff ghola is completely useless. This character does not contribute anything to the storyline nor does any of his actions.

He creates the sea worms. Why? What is the point of the seaworms? They create ultra spice, which is used once by the False Paul. Later, Waff returns to Rakis, fails in his experiments and then sees the worms return from some kind of shell deep underground. All of this could have been taken out.

The False Paul could have simply taken an overdose of regular spice, and then we could remove Waff, all his subplots and then simply make note of the return of the worms at the end. The character was not interesting and contributed nothing to the novel.

Constructive Criticism of the Expanded Dune Novels

When reading them all through, one after the other, a person can't help but notice a quality drop off. Upon finishing all three legends of Dune series and all three books of the House trilogy, within the first few pages of Dune I felt like a traveler lost in a desert, finally finding water.

Here is a screen shot of the user tags of the Expanded Dune Novel Winds of Dune:

Is this fair? I plan on going through, step by step, what I feel are legitimate complaints of the Expanded Dune series.

I Are Dune Blog

I am perhaps too pre-occupied with Frank Herbert's sci-fi saga Dune. As of a few days ago I finished reading all 16 published Dune novels in chronological order, and decided to start a blog to share some thoughts.